Legal Representation.

[cheez avenger]

I wanted to ask those like Feumet, etc.., about lawyers.

Do you guys have lawyers or firms on retainers. I don't recall Tim mentioning lawyers in the book. I know he talked about power of attorney, but not actual legal representation. You, know in case stuff happens.



Cheers!



-cheez avenger

[ted]

I use PPL (www.prepaidlegal.com) and have felt like it is a good value. They have templates members can use, in addition to LLC and incorporation docs they have these business templates available for use plus many other categories:

# Business

* Address Change Notice to Contacts

* Affidavit of No Lien

* Affidavit of Third Party

* Agreement to Form Partnership in the Future to Conduct Business

* Assignment of Copyright

* Cancel/Close Account Notice

* Complaint Letter to Retail Store

* Demand for Past Due Payment

* Dishonored Check Notice

* FDCPA Stop Harassment from Collection Agency Letter

* Installment Promissory Note

* Notice of Debt Dispute to Debt Collector

* Notice of Debt Dispute to Original Creditor

* Notice of Lost or Stolen Credit Card

* Notice to Cancel a Contract

* Notice to Cancel a Membership or Subscription

* Notice to Creditor that Account Holder Has Died

* Performance Evaluation Letter

* Receipt for Tangible Donation

* Request for Estimate or Quote

* Satisfaction and Release of Court Judgment

* Unauthorized Bank Account Withdrawal

* Unsolicited Advertisement by Facsimile

[cheez avenger]

I heard prepaid legal was scam. They are a Multi Level Marketer.

They say that some of the services they offer can be provided for free by a lawyer face to face-instead of paying monthly fees.



-cheez avenger

[ted]

PPL is not a scam, I've used them several times as a member. They do use network mktg to sell their service, but that's their right. They are a public company, stock symbol PPL, and can be checked out (it's gone up 50% the last 12 months). I don't sell their service. I keep it because it has more than paid for itself ($26/month for the whole family). It's been handy to have with 2 teenage boys driving...

When I have a question I call them and they call me back quickly (does your lawyer do that?). They give me advice multiple times on an issue and will send a letter or make a phone call as part of the base service, per issue, no limit. Yes, if it's more complex they may start to ask for a fee.

OK, I'm tired of trying to remember it all, here is a copy-paste for the family plan, they also have small business plans:

Expanded Family Plan
Preventive Legal Services

Phone Consultations on Unlimited Matters

As a member, you can consult with your Provider Law Firm toll free by phone on any personal or business-related matter. Just call your Provider's toll-free number during regular business hours when you have a legal problem or question.

Phone Calls and Letters...

A phone call or letter from your Provider Lawyer can get you the results you want fast. Your Provider Lawyer will recommend a letter or phone call when that is the best step for you. One call or letter per personal subject related matter is free with your membership. Plus, you'll receive two business letters each year at no additional cost! Additional assistance for same subject at 25% discount.

Contract and Document Review...

You can have an unlimited number of personal legal documents, up to ten pages each, reviewed by your Provider Lawyer. Included each year is one business document review at no additional cost! Your Provider Lawyer will analyze the documents and suggest changes for your benefit before you sign.

Wills for You and Your Family...

A Will for you at no additional charge, not just a "simple" Will, but one that meets most Americans' needs - with free yearly reviews and updates. Wills for covered family members are just $20 each; changes and updates $20. Trust preparation is available at a 25% discount.

* Additional Information & Exclusions
Motor Vehicle Legal Expense Services

Minor Legal Expenses

Your Provider Lawyer will represent you or your covered family members against moving traffic violations at no additional cost to you. Now you can have help with traffic tickets and not have to worry about the cost of representation.

Major Legal Expenses

Your Provider Lawyer will defend you or your covered family members when you are charged with Manslaughter, Involuntary Manslaughter, Negligent Homicide, or Vehicular Homicide at no added cost to you.

And add up to 2.5 hours for help with..

* Damage recovery service
* Driver's license assistance
* Personal injury legal expenses

* Additional Information & Exclusions
Trial Defense Services

Lawsuits cause tremendous emotional and financial stress. Your Pre-Paid Legal membership offers assistance when you need it most.

Up to 75 hours of lawyer time...

During your first membership year, you have up to 75 hours of your Provider Lawyer's time at no additional cost when you or your spouse is named defendant or respondent in a covered civil or criminal action filed in a court of law. The criminal action must be one which arises out of the direct performance of the covered person's employment activities. Your Provider Firm can advise you of the documents required to determine coverage under this benefit.

Of these 75 hours, up to 17.5 hours may be used for all legal services rendered in defense of the covered suit prior to actual trial. Up to 57.5 of the remaining hours are available for actual trial time including covered criminal preliminary hearings.

Your hours of service increase...

When you renew your membership, your hours of lawyer time increase as follows:

2nd year renewal: Up to 140 hours of assistance at no additional charge including up to 23 hours of pre-trial time.

3rd year renewal: Up to 205 hours of assistance at no additional charge including up to 28.5 hours of pre-trial time.

4th year renewal: Up to 270 hours of assistance at no additional charge including up to 34 hours of pre-trial time.

5th year renewal: Up to 335 hours of assistance at no additional charge including up to 39.5 hours of pre-trial time.

* Additional Information & Exclusions
IRS Audit Legal Services

Your Pre-Paid Legal membership will help you defray the costs of an IRS audit and give you the legal support you need.

Up to 50 hours of lawyer time...

You have up to 50 hours of your Provider Lawyer's time available at no additional cost when you or a covered family member receives written notice of an IRS audit or are requested to appear at IRS offices regarding your tax return. Your 50 hours are available as follows:

Up to one hour for consultation, advice, and assistance when you receive written notice from the IRS of audit or appearance.

If there is no settlement within 30 days, you have up to 2.5 hours for audit representation, negotiations, phone conversations, and settlement conferences prior to litigation.

If there is no settlement without litigation, up to 46.5 of the remaining hours are available for actual trial appearance if the IRS sues you, or you pay the disputed tax and sue the IRS.

* Additional Information & Exclusions
Other Legal Services

Your Provider Lawyer will render assistance at a 25% reduction to his or her standard hourly rate* for you or your spouse should you need legal services not covered by this plan. A retainer may be required for services being rendered under this benefit. Five days are required for preparation for court representation.

[Marcie]

I get occassional emails from this site at work http://www.legalzoom.com - I think my company has some kind of deal with them to offer us discounts, so it should be a reputable place.

[jafine21]

I am a lawyer so I'll be happy to share some truths about PPL vs. conventional law firms vs. legalzoom and the like.

PPL is a good deal for small tasks like contracts, small claims suits, etc. It is inexpensive, and your total cost is mitigated.

The disadvantages are that PPL attorneys make their money on volume, not on providing a lot of thought or time in a given case. I have never worked for a PPL program, but I know lawyers who have, and it is a tough way to make a living, so PPL lawyers are usually spread pretty thin.

Conventional law firms usually give you more personalized service, but it costs much more. Also, the economic structure of a conventional firm makes it a bad deal for clients. Without going into too much detail, law firms typically bill by the hour for work; however, there are two things working against you in that regard. First, associates (and partners) have an incentive to bill as much as possible, so they will maximize the time it takes to perform a task. Second, bigger firms will often charge you for a set amount of time on a given task, instead of the actual time involved. It's like an ASE certified mechanic - they charge you 2.5 hours to replace your wheel bearings no matter how much time it takes, because that's what the ASE book says. The bad thing about law firms is that they often have done very similar work before, so they may charge you 5 hours to write something that would normally take 5 hours, but only took them one hour because they had written a similar pleading before.

I would not recommend legalzoom or other legal form sites. Every state is different and laws change frequently. I live in North Carolina, which has a ton of odd laws, and I know from experience that a legal form from a website missed some of the vagaries of NC law to the point that the document was worthless.

In short, I'd recommend PPL as a viable option. If the case gets too big for PPL, you can always go to a regular firm and you haven't spent that much $$. IF you need a conventional law firm, go to a smaller shop (no more than 10 lawyers) that is less of a slave to the typical law firm billing model. Ask the firm if they bill actual time, and if you think a bill is too high call them and negotiate over it. Firms will often "write off" time to keep a client happy. Also, you can negotiate the billing rate in advance - it is not set in stone. If you can impress upon them that you are likely to be a repeat customer because of the growing nature of your business, they will cut the rate. You can also ask for a flat-fee for the work - you will usually come out ahead, even if the quoted flat-fee seems high.

Finally, keep in mind that legal work takes time. It is not unusual for actual time on a novel project to = an hour per page for research, writing, revising, assembling of exhibits, etc. A 30 page motion, at $200 per hour, is a big chunk of change.

Hope that helps. PM me if you have any other specific questions.