Can I hire someone to run my business [Archive] - The 4-Hour Work Week and Timothy Ferriss

Madmouse2

12-21-2008, 03:46 AM

I guess this sounds crazy, but I had an idea for a food product business and I have no experience running ANY kind of business. (Also, I have no interest in doing it; I prefer the 4 hr. work week model. To be sure, I am trying to learn to do internet marketing, but that's about all.)

Assuming I could get all the pieces of this to make sense, how would I go about hiring someone to manage the business? More to the point, how would I know whether or not they were doing a good job? But if they were doing any reasonable kind of job, I would be making more money than I am now...

Thanks for your thoughts on this!

kamakiri

12-21-2008, 04:54 AM

Also, I have no interest in doing it; I prefer the 4 hr. work week model.

Let me get this straight... you only want to work 4 hours a week and not interested in doing the work to get there?

There is a much easier and cheaper solution. Quit your job and go on welfare. If you aren't interested in doing the work, go back to your day job (did that sound like a broken record?).

Napoleon

12-21-2008, 08:20 AM

Hi Madmouse! Don't listen to flamers. You'll find many people like that on this forum and they obviously know nothing about running a successful business so just ignore them.

If you have an idea for a food product business and you don't want to manage the business, you're on the right track. That's what the 4HWW is all about, having others work for you while you just supervise them. Currently, I have people taking care of all my muses without a problem. Also, there are some people that trust me and let me in charge of their businesses while they're on vacation or when they are sick. You just have to find the right person to take care of your business. You can start by hiring someone for a short period of time and testing them. If they prove they're reliable, you can hire them for a longer period of time. If they remain honest, you may give them total control of your business while you do other things. Again, I do this all the time and I have had very few problems with the people in charge of my businesses. :)

I guess this sounds crazy, but I had an idea for a food product business and I have no experience running ANY kind of business. (Also, I have no interest in doing it; I prefer the 4 hr. work week model. To be sure, I am trying to learn to do internet marketing, but that's about all.)

Assuming I could get all the pieces of this to make sense, how would I go about hiring someone to manage the business? More to the point, how would I know whether or not they were doing a good job? But if they were doing any reasonable kind of job, I would be making more money than I am now...

Thanks for your thoughts on this!

Sven

12-21-2008, 11:18 AM

Napoleon

12-21-2008, 12:46 PM

Well Napoleon, you are out to gain popularity by doing some flaming yourself?

You have obviously not read enough of Kam's posts. He always gives good replies to well asked questions. Maybe you do not know a good question when you see one?

@ Madmouse:
If you have no experience in running a business you won't be able to tell if the people you hire do a good job. You need to gain the experience first or you are in risk of being prayed upon.
Kam's reply may be harsh but I'm affraid it's true...

All questions on this forum are GOOD. But not all replies are actually good. There's no rule on this forum that specifies that questions have to be "good". I think that if someone doesn't know something and asks a question, the question is legitimate just because he doesn't know the answer!!!

Now, a rude or sarcastic remark or just a useless comment is a BAD answer.

Madmouse, your question is GOOD, don't listen to people.

Madmouse2

12-21-2008, 02:25 PM

Sven

12-21-2008, 02:28 PM

If all questions are good, so are all the anwers. If you claim otherwise you claim to have ALL knowledge.

Madmouse, Napoleon is part of people too.

bmonsma

12-21-2008, 03:52 PM

Let me get this straight... you only want to work 4 hours a week and not interested in doing the work to get there?

There is a much easier and cheaper solution. Quit your job and go on welfare. If you aren't interested in doing the work, go back to your day job (did that sound like a broken record?).

Hi, Kamakiri.

Are you in the middle of a divorce, about to go to Iraq for deployment, or something else equally stressful that compels you to be an asshole to everyone on this message board?

We're all out to help each other and you seem to do nothing but put people down, judging from the posts I've seen. That's not helpful. You don't even put a positive spin on it and you seem to take members' posts the worst way possible just to insult them.

I would care less what you say if you didn't bring such a negative tone to a cool forum where people are bettering themselves.

Dude, grow up. If you can't play nice, go somewhere else.

Madmouse2

12-21-2008, 04:37 PM

If all questions are good, so are all the anwers. If you claim otherwise you claim to have ALL knowledge.

Madmouse, Napoleon is part of people too.

******************************

I'm not sure what you're saying here, Sven. I certainly don't claim to have all knowledge. In this case, I'm openly saying I don't have ANY! (And "answers" that tell me to go on welfare just aren't that useful. Some answers are definitely more helpful than others.)

I realize that Napoleon is "part of people too". (What's that about anyway?) I would love to hear more about how he hires people to run businesses for him. That is a major part of what I am trying to figure out.

bmonsma

12-21-2008, 05:09 PM

I haven't been on this forum for awhile, but I'm glad to see that Kamakiri hasn't gone soft on us. :D

Look--I'm not lazy. There are just some things I am interested in doing and others that I'm not interested in doing, like learning how to run a food product business. But I don't think I should just drop what may be a good business idea. I don't know how to hire someone to manage it, but it's nice to hear that at least one person out there has made that kind of thing work! Like I said, if I made ANYTHING off this idea, it would be more than I'm making off it now. Maybe if it took off at all, someone would want to buy me out. You don't know until you try, right?

Makes sense, although I don't know if I would put too much energy to an idea you don't like even if its great. You may not stick with it and you'll waste a bunch of time. There are 1000s of muse ideas around us all the time. You have to narrow down to the ones that you'll love pursuing.

But if you're set on the business, post ads on craigslist, monster as an employer, and entrepreneurial forums, etc. Think anywhere people qualified to run a business might go. Ask for resumes, advertise your job opening, even post on here and on blogs. You might find a person who just wants to take something from an idea to operational and profitable. Check MBA programs and talk to Career Management Centers at colleges. Could find an intern who will help for free and write about it for his thesis.

Sven

12-21-2008, 05:13 PM

This is getting steamy...

It seems to me that Napoleon is claiming to have all the knowlege.
I feel that if you say that all questions that are asked to this community are good, you can not complain if you do not like the answeres you recieve. I am 100% sure that Kam answers to the best of his experience. I do the same. Both Kam and I could sweeten what we write but it would not change the content. It would take at least twice as long to write which would not suit a 20/80 aproach.

Play nice? Would it be nice to let one set of on a path that leads to obvious failure?
If you want nice answers go to your friends or maybe your parents. If you want answers to get you somewhere, to get you thinking? Ask the questions here.

If you ask in oneliners, prepair for short and harsh answers.
If you take the time to formulate a question that shows you have done the legwork you will probably get a well thought trough answers, Kam included.

That was the last I will write on this.

Madmouse2

12-21-2008, 05:39 PM

Bmonsma,

Thanks for the suggestions. I especially like the one about checking out college business schools/programs for students who might like to take this on as a project. Now I remember that there is a b-school nearby, where students have done exactly that sort of thing in the past. Hmmm! :-)

webgal

12-21-2008, 06:45 PM

Many people will read the 4HWW and see only the end result and not the part to get there.

I think one thing we need to get over here is the sensitivity. Don't get wrapped up in petty arguments. They are counterproductive. There will be more than one view on things. It's an international forum.

"I disagree", is basically all anyone needs to say. Then you can go on to state your position. There will be disagreements but they can be more cordial. And if someone doesn't care to listen, let them learn by themselves. I believe in the "fall on your face" methodology of learning.

Sven has put things pretty succinctly in his post above. And both Sven and Kam have over a thousand posts together. Kam has a successful business although he's not hit 4 hours per week with it. And Sven is an inventor with a patented product. Many of you have no clue how much work and perseverance patenting an invention requires. Tossing your guts onto the street and having them stomped on is almost easier.

So I would suggest giving some posts by loyal 4HWW members some thoughtful reflection instead of hitting the reactive trigger.

Create succinct posts that ask well thought out questions. The "give me an idea for a muse" type posts will get harsh answers as will the "I want to work 4 hours a week and do as little as possible to get there."

Sven

12-21-2008, 07:01 PM

Well, actually I do not have the patent. I did take the route towards it, complete with attorney fees but decided that it was not worth spending more money and time in this niche. It did give me valuable knowledge on the value of patents and the way the process works.

sub8hr

12-21-2008, 08:16 PM

This is starting to get WAY off topic. I generally appreciate Sven's posts. Although in my opinion overly harsh and blunt, I used to also like Kamakiri's posts. Though I must concur that lately they are a little bit too over the top, including one-liner false accusations of plagiarism. If you behaved that way in a company you didn't own, you would be fired or "attitude adjusted," straight up. The loyalty to the board and responsiveness to people's questions I like, but the tone I most definitely do not. It really is uncalled for and inappropriate. There is a difference between giving someone the straight dope and just insulting them. I hope that Kamakiri continues to share his experience here because I do think that he has value to offer to the board, but do hope that there is some change in the high-handed tone.

webgal

12-21-2008, 11:15 PM

Fair enough observation, sub8hr.

And Sven, I did think you had the patent. A friend of mine recently traveled that road and it was pretty difficult, expensive and time consuming.

As far as the topic, that is about finding someone to run a business. Madmouse2 has said he has not run a business, so I think you need a good business consultant. A client recently wanted me to start a marketing plan and I told him that that was putting the cart before the horse. In this case, he needed a business plan first so he could get funding. This consultant I referred offers a payment plan to make the process affordable and he is the type of guy with the connections to financial backers.

The product is good and we will need some kind of marketing plan to sell the idea. But a lot of the info I need is going to be based on how it is manufactured, the price point, ease of assembly, distribution just to name a few. But the crucial step in this case is to prepare and present a business plan that inspires someone to take a chance on a product because without funding, we don't have media dollars and gorilla marketing will only go so far. The guy has worked on it 12 years. It's presently in Korea being perfected. He has the patent.

So that's just one case study on taking one product to market. To be frank, I'm typically pulled in once the business plan is complete. I've done many product launches that included naming and TM, but this is the first one I've been involved in that was in its infancy.

With a food product, there are laws to contend with. So while you can get help in developing a business, you will either need experience, money or a passion to get it started. You can be a "flipper"--start a business, then sell it. But it will take effort and persistence.

Madmouse2

12-22-2008, 12:16 AM

Webgal,

Thanks for your input--you have given me a lot to think about. Thanks, too, for the links.

Keep a Movin' Dan

12-22-2008, 12:31 AM

I don't have a perspective on the main issue here, but I'm bothered by Sven's behavior.If all questions are good, so are all the anwers. If you claim otherwise you claim to have ALL knowledge.There's a difference between questions and answers: to ask a question, you only need some idea of what you don't know. To give an answer, you need to be able to give the right answer. And as far as I can tell, I can claim to know this without claiming to have all knowledge.I am 100% sure that Kam answers to the best of his experience. I do the same. Both Kam and I could sweeten what we write but it would not change the content. It would take at least twice as long to write which would not suit a 20/80 aproach.How does "The answer to your question is 'no'" take twice as long as "The answer to your question is 'no,' and if you're asking it you should just go on welfare"? As far as I can tell, the latter response only serves to make things awkward for people who have other information.

kamakiri

12-22-2008, 01:27 AM

Wow. Thanks for the support guys. Now that this thread is completely off topic, I would like to add some insight to it. I know in my heart, this is what you all think of me (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2kfUpRH6no&feature=related).

I have said this before, but real life is a far harsher judge than Sven, sub8 or I could ever be. I truly wish that everyone aspiring to cut the daily toil out of their lives had the opportunity, and I believe that we all have the skills to do it. The limiting factors are us. There is no free lunch, but if you do some foot work, you can get a damn close approximation of it.

It is a far greater disservice to add flowery praise or support to half baked plans and pie in the sky wishes. I think Tim makes a very bad mistake in his book by not emphasizing the actual work necessary to make some of the changes that need to be made to join the NR.

Why doesn't he put more emphasis on them? Because people don't want to hear the truth. Tim wrote his book to sell books, and he did a very good job of it. For all of the people with an entitlement mentality and no intention of doing any hard work, this book might seem like a god send. We have all seen it 1000 times. It is the "Wow! I just read Tim's book and am sooo pumped!" or "I have an idea, but am not going to tell anyone what it is. How do I sell it?" posters who come on, make 4 posts and leave after a discouraging response. (You would think that since they found this forum, they could at least google some of this stuff).

I am sorry (just a little bit) that my message gets lost in the tone. Putting people down is not my intention. The opposite of support is not contrarian posts. It is silence.

Marcie

12-22-2008, 02:20 AM

OK all - please remember that it's hard to detect sarcasm, etc. on a message board. I have been reading this thread (of course) and for the record, Tim (and I, and webgal) are not big fans of censorship. We want good quality discussion. That said, let me reiterate the last part of the (simple) forum rules:

"2. NO flaming. If you are mean or degrading to others, you will be banned. Feel free to be critical, but be civilized and suggest alternatives if you disagree with someone.

Be cool, be nice, and play hard!

Pura vida,

Tim"

OK? Let's get back on topic. Thanks again for everyone's positive contributions!

clanshrapnel

12-22-2008, 03:04 AM

Kam has a deep message that is very easy to gloss over: Getting TO the 4HWW is not a simple task. Unfortunately, that has 2 negative effects: 1) naysayers to the 4HWW think the book is a joke since there 'appears' to be no work involved 2) those interested in the 4HWW may jump on board with the idea, but they may be unprepared for the work involved to get there. These 2 negative effects are just in exchange for getting more people on board with the idea (not the worst thing, really). This book would not be on a best seller list with the title 'The 4 Hour Workweek after 400+ Hours to get there'.

Kam, Sven, any anybody else who may sound harsh at times (myself included) may reply bluntly, but think of it this way: this allows the forum to effectively and efficiently circulate discussion. There's plenty of good information on the forums that I've used myself, mostly from well-framed and researched questions.

bmonsma

12-22-2008, 04:08 AM

I'm going to say one more thing because there's a lot of justification of rudeness as being "real world experience." Blunt is fine, because who has time for fluff? Many of us are on here because we're committed to pushing something forward. Downright insulting others who you don't know is wrong and seems like a passive-aggressive way to release aggression. Just as it's not easy to detect sarcasm, it's not easy to decipher those who are sincere and new from those who are lazy and half-hearted. If you generalize a tone on here, it seems like "nice" would be better than an unnecessary rudeness that takes more air and typing than a simple "no" or "I disagree" would.

Kamikiri seems like he's been skimming threads, looking for posts he could bash. It's not difficult to think of MORE concise words delivered in a more polite manner. Sven doesn't seem as harsh, just more of the to-the-point and that's a huge difference.

And I'm done with the topic, too. Please don't insult those you clearly know more than. That's like a dad beating his kid for not knowing HOW to take out the trash and so makes a mess on the kitchen floor. Pointless and ineffective.

Thanks.