Getting off the ground

[Christoph]

Ironically enough I am surfing the forums right after I read the “media fast” section earlier this morning. Tisk, tisk. Some info: I am graduating college with a BS in Management (3.84, yank yank) in a month, and having been in the quasi office situation, managing sub retards for about 7 months; I can say that I am definitely not paid what I believe I am worth. My question is simple: what do I need to start? I’m sure as I finish the book it will become obvious (I’ll probably finish it tonight actually), but my main problem is current revolving debt. How do I break that? I absolutely cannot afford to stop the conventional job in lieu of my own.

I have a car lease, rent, school tuition, hell, you name it and I probably have it. That makes my liquid cash assets hardly anything to blink an eye at. This book has given me a ferocious want to succeed and goddammit I am willing to absorb any an all advice to try and make it a reality. I might be shooting my own foot by making this my first post, and before finishing the book, but when I get a hair up my ass I have to act on it.

What would everyone recommend for a 23 year old with too much ambition for his britches? What small avenue could I take for extra income now that would in turn pave the way for a bigger and more profitable venture? I’m just a dumbshit kid with NR dreams. I’d like to make it happen.

Thanks in advance to anyone who chimes in. I hope to learn from everyone’s personal success stories along the way!!

[TXnative]

I'd sell all your useless shit asap for sure. What don't you use that has value? I bet there's a lot of stuff if you're in college. Its in the book, so finish the book first of all. Do you really need the gadgetry? Probably not. If you have trouble committing to this then you need to reevaluate your situation (probably, I don't want to come down hard on you or anything).

[cornflower]

I found Dave Ramsey (www.mytotalmoneymakeover.com) good for getting out of debt and changing my mindset about money. Listening to the daily podcasts is good.. changing money habits is like changing food habits - it all sounds logical and simple, until you add people and their emotions to the mix.

Whilst you are limiting your "out go", work on Tim's outlines to increase your "income" as well. I'm finding getting rid of my consumer debt very freeing.

[Christoph]

I hardly take it as you coming down hard on me, hell, if anything, I need the swift kick. It's not like I am a mess or irresponsible, I just accrued more debt due to school in a short period of time. I'll dig deep into Dave Ramsey's site and hope to gain an understanding, or course of action, on how to get myself in a positive flow.

I do have quite a bit of useless shit just waiting to either rot or be sold. I'll choose the latter. I just need to find the proper medium (probably ebay or craigslist) and then get my ass in gear. I don't want to accept 'this' for what it is when I know I can do something about it.

I think i'll make that my plan of attack for the weekend. Find, document, and sell all the unnecessary BS I have. I guess this is the first step on a long staircase. Thanks so far!

[jetpacklife]

While getting your debt under control should be a main priority, don't let it stop you from forming and working on an action plan. There's lots of ultra inexpensive or free stuff you can start learning and working on online. Also, the rewards of the plan will help motivate you.

At one point I had a 6 figure debt (mostly college loans) and a full time job I hated. That's all behind me now. My biggest mistake was not thinking of enough things to do once I actually had free time!

[Batman]

What would everyone recommend for a 23 year old with too much ambition for his britches? What small avenue could I take for extra income now that would in turn pave the way for a bigger and more profitable venture? I’m just a dumbshit kid with NR dreams. I’d like to make it happen.

Thanks in advance to anyone who chimes in. I hope to learn from everyone’s personal success stories along the way!!

23yo with loads of ambition?

Use your evenings well

Try online affiliate programs

or Network Marketing

or Ebay sales

or even a lawn service only if you aren't the straw that stirs the drink (hire crews and take a smaller percentage)

[TXnative]

The best way to sell your stuff through Craigslist (I'm not talking about an actual business, I'm just talking about freeing up some cash for personal gain) is to get people on the phone. Its a good way to learn how negotiating works and its exponentially easier than answering 100 stupid questions which can be answered by reading your original add. Don't waste your time because someone is impulse buying your used shit, move to the fastest, closest, and most reasonable buyer and make your deal.

I would then advise not taking every piece of advice you get from online strangers.

[Christoph]

Ha, believe me, I do not take every little bit of information to be fact, especially from an online forum. I do, however, have more inclination to trust people who are after the same thing and obviously have some smarts, such as those on this one.

Once I round up all my excess shit laying around the house, I will definitely list it on Craigslist, and probably ebay for good measure.

I have free evenings (besides the periodic band practice) so I plan to maximize that time to the fullest. I'll research the stuff you said, Batman, and see what it can do for me. I've been on ebay for almost a decade and have made some nice profits. It's just a matter of finding what people want.

[RusSEAL]

Wow...

First time on this forum and already I'm learning something new!

"Craigslist.com"? If it has any more penache' than e-bay [got fleeced on the fees a couple of times- sheesh] I'll certainly give it a try.

For me, "mobilization stagnation" definitely stems from finances- 4 bed house, cars daycare... I'm learning that the time management thing and the "self inflicted ignorance' goes a long way in helping with that.

Still, I had to take a pause and also note that the imposed tech moritorium is the first thing I've broken as well! :eek:

Just now half-way through the book; some of it I've read in other time-management self helps; so I'm hoping there's a general "guidemap" that'll better help me understand hyow best to market myself as part of this NR paradigm [DEAL vs DELA helps- but the mechanics I'm just not getting].

One thing that'll help immensely is the use of this forum- glad to be here and a part of it all!

[searstower]

Christoph,
Definitely, use those evenings well. Do some research and start running your muse part time. Why not?

That is exactly what I've been doing. My day job in Tech Support pays for the mortgage, etc, and my web design business (I don't actually do the design, of course) has finally gotten so big that I'll be giving my two weeks notice in the middle of June, right after my husband transitions himself into his new job.

It's amazing how much time I actually had when I stopped using my evenings to watch CSI and my weekends to sleep in and eat out.

Go for it!
Rebecca

[Christoph]

These last few weeks are kind of a pain for me due to finals and whatnot, but after 2 June; it is on.

I am taking a trip to Vegas/San Diego next week as an early 'good job me' deal. I plan to fully turn off and reset out there. Coming back will be painful as I will still have the same BS to deal with. I'm quite confident nothing will change in 5 days but the weather. Ugh.

I've spent some time looking through various ways to capitalize on my passions, but the market is over saturated as it is. How in the hell could I begin to compete with the 'big boys' of the game, and, even against those more knowledgeable than I on this board!

I have the distinct feeling that I come off as timid, but that is far from the case...just directionless :(

[searstower]

How about this... You give us all your hobbies, skills and current knowledge, and we'll give you some product ideas.

What do you do now for fun?
What have you done for fun in the past?
What are your skills?


The more you tell us, whether you think it's relevant or not, the more we can help.

Don't worry about competing with the rest of us, we've all got different experience and backgrounds anyway, so there really is not competition, just different niches.

Rebecca

[Christoph]

You're one smart cookie!!

My interests are far and wide, vague and concrete. Nothing like contradictions to start the thought process, eh? Not being cliche, but I love music, and have been devoted to playing it for years, namely drums and percussion. I know the market is oversaturated with idiots trying to show us how to do something special, and I don't believe I want to do that. Hence where the niche or unique part comes in.

I like and excel at sex, but how in the hell could you market that? Fetish porn? Ha!

One area, which is improving greatly, is talking with people. I have no issues getting up in front of a class and talking about something I know nothing about. I practice daily on fine tuning my non-verbal communication, and to my delight, it's working. If I had my druthers and had money on the line, I would, however, prefer to be completely in tune with my product.

I'm a good negotiator (never had an opportunity with sales though), I can resolve conflicts well, and generally use my charisma to light up (or piss off) parties. I am damn cocky and need to find out if it can be used to my advantage or not.

Dammit, now I'm in the spotlight and having a hard time trying to quantify what I like, and am good at.:eek: Thanks a lot!!

[searstower]

I love music, and have been devoted to playing it for years, namely drums and percussion. I know the market is oversaturated with idiots trying to show us how to do something special, and I don't believe I want to do that.

Performing is tough to automate unless you get a record contract, but... Most drummers can't read drum music, but symphony students need to know how to do that. Find percussionists who need to learn to read drum music at private and prep schools, hire the top 3 drummers you know personally, set up the classes and equipment and take a commission.

I like and excel at sex, but how in the hell could you market that? Fetish porn? Ha!

How do you think Cosmopolitan sells so many magazines? "Top 10 ways to make him scream in bed" "Three sex tricks you've never seen before" "Guys speak out: Their biggest turnons - and turnoffs" Someone writes those articles.

One area, which is improving greatly, is talking with people. I have no issues getting up in front of a class and talking about something I know nothing about.

Then maybe think about becoming a trainer. This is a great way to build any business, but in particular an information based business. Most people think that speakers make very little money, but if you do it right, then you can easily make $20,000 a weekend speaking, set yourself up as an expert and then just sell books & tapes via dropship while you hang out in Thailand! The trick is to have backend products which you can sell from the stage.

I could tell you a ton more about how to make that kind of money training, but I'll wait on writing out the novel unless that's what you want to do.

What would you train? Sex education, the kama sutra, negotiation, corporate communication skills, conflict resolution, etc.

Try those on for size and see how they feel,
Rebecca

[Christoph]

Damn...you're good.

I would like to market myself, but I first need to figure out a way to set myself apart from the herd of drones who act the part but don't live up to it. Essentially 'getting the foot in the door' so to speak.

Which is more difficult, selling a product, or selling services in person? I know that defies the liberation part, but if it could yield more in return, I would be willing to explore options. But, as always, defining what it is would be the starting point.

I could sign up for 3-4 credentials easily right now for $5 if I so chose. That would pad my claim as 'expert' status, yes, but would they be worth it? My fiance and I are ALWAYS the go to people when people have relationship problems. That is a route we collectively thought of: Relationship help for the real couples, by a real couple. Lame title, but you get the idea.

Trust me, your responses are provoking thought and that is exactly what I need if I am ever going to make something happen by the time I hit 24 next year.

Preemptive edit- I actually have kind of a floodgate opening in my head...the wheels are churning!!!

[searstower]

I would like to market myself, but I first need to figure out a way to set myself apart from the herd of drones who act the part but don't live up to it. Essentially 'getting the foot in the door' so to speak.

Market yourself as what?

Did you know that one of the top reasons that entrepreneurs fail is that they focus more on having a good product than they do on having good sales?

Everyone thinks that before they get into business, they need an amazing product, but the truth is, they just need a good product and good sales skills.

When I started designing websites, I noticed that some of my clients took me on because they needed a website and they didn't see anyone else who they thought could do it better. Does that mean a better product didn't exist? No. All it means is that I was there at the right time with a decent version of the product they were looking to buy.

The point is, get your foot in the door with a decent product that has good demand.

Which is more difficult, selling a product, or selling services in person?

Damn...you're good.

Thanks, I better be. Or my poor clients paying me as a business coach would be getting the short end of the deal.

I know I haven't answered everything yet, but it's time for me to leave the office now and find things to fill the void of constantly checking my email!

Keep moving, you can do it.
Rebecca

[Christoph]

Shameless bump.

I have had almost no time to think about my projects due to last minute school BS and my trip. I had the idea for a mini-retirement to go to Vegas for 5 days, so that is where I'm off to tomorrow.

Once I get back, I have 1 week of school left and then I will seriously dedicate almost all of my free time at home and work to brainstorm as many ideas as possible.

This is far from over!!!!

-Chris

[VitaminD]

Keep going Chris. It's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when.

[bluthco]

C,

If you're not being paid what you feel you're worth, my question is, "What are you worth and how did you arrive at that figure?"

GOB

[soulstice]

My fiance and I are ALWAYS the go to people when people have relationship problems. That is a route we collectively thought of: Relationship help for the real couples, by a real couple. Lame title, but you get the idea.


Sounds like a great idea to me. We've been in this time of "He's Just Not That Into You" and commercials for Match.com and eHarmony.com in regular rotation on TV for a few years now; there's definitely a market of "okay, I've found him/her, how do I keep him/her?" people out there. And the fact that you're in your early twenties narrows it to another niche.

[AdamTeece]

Christoph, I am right there with you being 23 and overly ambitious. I am jumping in sink or swim in about 5 months. I'm in the Navy right now and on my final deployment, just had a nice stop in Singapore. I'm not as far into The 4-Hour Workweek as you because I just got the book in the ships mail about 4 days ago, but I am very excited with what I have read so far. I recently started my own web design company, incorporated, created a logo, have some very interested potential clients, and done almost everything official that I had to do. The only problem, with as muc has I like design and the web, I only know the very bare basics and can't yet make the sites that I know my clients will want. So now I am trying to figure out what to do from here, possibly outsourcing the work, but with no initial cashflow yet, that might be a little hard. I think this forum might be a great place to get and share ideas.

[Christoph]

Sounds like a great idea to me. We've been in this time of "He's Just Not That Into You" and commercials for Match.com and eHarmony.com in regular rotation on TV for a few years now; there's definitely a market of "okay, I've found him/her, how do I keep him/her?" people out there. And the fact that you're in your early twenties narrows it to another niche.


I might embark on that route. It would be interesting to write and keep me busy during traditional working hours and if it could generate any sort of income, hey, I'm all for it. Just today I got a text from a friend asking for a "second opinion" (on top of my dozens) on his recent split with his girlfriend. More times than not, I am right.

Now, for an ebook, how many pages would one suggest I draft up, and, should the cost be commensurate with the impact of the content or just the page length? Once I'm done writing it, where should I go to start selling it. Ebay? Craigslist?

Danke!

[AdamTeece]

Christoph, I think the length would depend on the topic covered and how much information you are covering in it. If the information is only worth 15 pages but is very useful, you could still sell it very easily. If you take 15 pages worth of information and turn it into 90 pages, isn't that going against everything The 4-Hour Work Week talks about? Shouldn't all of us be trying to get more people to be more efficient and effective?

[Christoph]

Adam-

15-20 was roughly what my target page content would be. The more I think about it, I might consider doing half -the man side- and then letting my fiance do the other -woman- half, which would not only broaden the market in a sense, but would offer different perspectives to common issues

I might do it for shits and grins honestly, and if I sell it with profit, then all the better. There is an abundance of relationship books, and quite frankly they all suck and dont get into the 'real' part of being in a modern, young relationship.

What do you all suggest for a price though? $5-15?

[Christoph]

C,

If you're not being paid what you feel you're worth, my question is, "What are you worth and how did you arrive at that figure?"

GOB

Right now, at 23, and a recent dual degree graduate, I get paid $15.50/hour. With all my school debt and other life expenses, I hardly have any leftover to save. I can easily say that I should be at about $40,000/year. Easily. I'm not a genius, and I'm not technically skilled.

I do believe I am worth being paid that, however, because of my interpersonal skills, excellent forcasting abilities, and my general charisma. I know that is not quantifying anything, but if you look at most workers, they are depressed with their job and ultimately slack off and are lower producers. Once I get an assignment, I have it turned in as fast as humanly possible, which frees up time to do more. It goes against the 4-hour work ethic, but realistically; that's all the work I put in during my 40-hour office stint anyways. I hate it. I wish I had the option to work at home but unfortunately I don't.

I do not wish to be a mindless office drone who constantly accepts work and then turns it in as I stated above. I want to be in control of my own finances and have my income be commensurate (or more) with my effort. Tim's book has changed my entire view on work and life in general, and quite frankly, I am so happy it came now than later. Christ, I'd be content pulling in an extra $2,000 per month if it afforded me the opportunity to switch from a mindless, semi-professional job, to a totally mindless, for kicks only job.

My brain is foggy so I hope to hell that made sense.

[Christoph]

... but with no initial cashflow yet, that might be a little hard. I think this forum might be a great place to get and share ideas.

I could not agree more. I am contemplating breaking my Jeep lease and getting a POS in order to save some cash, as well as selling my childhood toys and whatnot. I don't want to get rid of my car because I like driving a new one, but making a sacrifice might be a necessity to free up some cash. My mom is not too excited about me selling the stuff she bought me years ago, as it was expensive!! I'll try to convince her otherwise!

[Feumet]

Well I would save some of the stuff and stash it at Moms to make her feel better and to remind you of who you were, but you have the right idea. Get rid of it. It can be a pain in the butt. I have moved junk across the US several times and it is still just that. Keep a couple of things that you really like and get rid of the rest. it is a freeing experience. I wish I would have figured that out years ago.

Anyone in the market for a a meteorite collection? Have some nice ones,... LOL

[searstower]

I recently started my own web design company, incorporated, created a logo, have some very interested potential clients, and done almost everything official that I had to do. The only problem, with as muc has I like design and the web, I only know the very bare basics and can't yet make the sites that I know my clients will want. So now I am trying to figure out what to do from here, possibly outsourcing the work, but with no initial cashflow yet, that might be a little hard.

This is how I run my web business to work around that little cashflow issue:

Require a 1/3 good faith down payment before beginning any job. Then I use that 1/3 to pay the contractors for the first piece of work that they do.

Halfway through the project, the second 1/3 is due, from which I pay the contractors for the second phase.

Before the website goes live and I turn it over to the client (very, very important) the last 1/3 is due. From that I pay any remaining bills and bonuses.

As long as you build the right schedule into the contracts, you will never go negative!

Rebecca

[AdamTeece]

This is how I run my web business to work around that little cashflow issue:

Require a 1/3 good faith down payment before beginning any job. Then I use that 1/3 to pay the contractors for the first piece of work that they do.

Halfway through the project, the second 1/3 is due, from which I pay the contractors for the second phase.

Before the website goes live and I turn it over to the client (very, very important) the last 1/3 is due. From that I pay any remaining bills and bonuses.

As long as you build the right schedule into the contracts, you will never go negative!

Rebecca
Thanks very much for that info. That sounds like a great plan and I might just have to give that a try. It will definitely take some planning. Thanks again.

[jmarks]

I started a night job delivering pizzas to pay for a company in India to re-design my affiliate based review site and to pay for them to run a PPC campaign for me. It should be self-sufficient within a month.

The review site alone should be able to fund marketing for my other site and pay my monthly bills. It not only promotes my main sites products and services but those of my competitors as well. That way, whichever company (mine or my competition) my traffic chooses to work with, I get paid for it.

My second site will be my money maker. This sites revenues will allow me to focus on doing what I want to do and not what I have to do.

[Christoph]

Another shameless bump.

I graduated with 2 degrees last week--with honors (woo-hoo), and now have more time than I could have imagined at work to sit and ponder. Still talking with the wifey about collaborating on the e-book with me, and I think after I do all the initial research and notes (and get her final 'yes'), i'll get started once and for all this week.

I am also contemplating the minimalist living style that was advocated at the end of Tim's book. Has anyone tried it with success? I have to admit, I am ultra materialistic; it sucks, and I want to break it.

I have pretty much made up my mind that once I make a sizeable dent on my school loans, and complete my car and apartment lease, that I am going to travel extensively across the world. I figure why the hell not. Christ, i'm not getting younger, and if I decide to have kids, it would just complicate matters for me.

On another note, I was offered a sales position with high earning potential...but the 3-day training costs $2,700?!?! Screw that.

[MisterSuperBad]

1. quit using that type of negative language. i don't know why you are calling yourself a dumbshit. lol. the words you choose are very, very, very, important. ask yourself how could you afford to quit the job, instead of saying, "I can't." The phrase I can't should be banned.

2. you should read rich dad poor dad. stop buying doodads and buy assets. Pay for your doodads with your assets that generate a passive income. if you create a muse that is an asset. An asset is something taht puts money into your pocket. A doodad is something nice thats not necessary such as a bmw or a rolex watch.

3. Maybe you want to delay gratification on that car for a while. I would just drive a cheap car with good gas mileage thats paid off. Later when I have assets that generate a passive income I would buy a nicer car with that. right now you just need to get out of bad debt.

4. minimize your expenses and start a savings account with automatic withdrawal. The point of saving this money is so that you reinvest later on in assets that will bring you a passive income.

5. use the concept of always saving extra.

For example, dont' spend all your time or energy on anything. Always save 10-15%. Save money. Leave time to relax at the end of teh day. Leave time for reflection. Come to class early by 30 minutes. Always give yourself more time than you actually need.

Why? because you don't want to run out of time or energy, or do everything in a super rush. What if there is some emergency or something that pops up?

[squeegee]

On another note, I was offered a sales position with high earning potential...but the 3-day training costs $2,700?!?! Screw that.

dude that sounds super sketchy. google the company name and see what people say about it. I found an opportunity that sounded a lot like that and it turned out that they were hiring as many sales people as possible without regard to the number of salespeople needed to saturate the market for their product. in other words they were more interested in getting people to sign up and pay the training fee than to see their salesmen make money.

[Christoph]

I'm staying positive about most things...but the job search, wow. All the big name sites that offer career assistance are worthless. If I had a dime for every e-mail I got that said I could make 90k with no exp., I wouldnt need the job!!! (not literally, but you get it).

Minimizing my spending is not easy, especially since I'm getting married this summer, have an offer to go to Brazil, and all the other fun things that milk you. See the first paragraph, and if that wasn't an issue, neither would my spending/saving!!!

The stock market went to hell in a handbag yesterday, so if it plunges today, I will have to sell. Fantastic way to be introduced to the market! ha!