Are Psychedelic Drugs the Next Medical Breakthrough? (#104)

I found the mention of REM sleep in this conversation extremely pertinent to my experiences when I was an undiagnosed narcoleptic. I would repeatedly succumb to these, often frightening, hallucinations (visual, auditory, and tactile). A more enjoyable, yet equally confusing behaviour was this profound sequence of visions that would often precede falling asleep (for fear of sounding overly woo-woo, I’ll refrain from providing examples).

In order to be diagnosed, I had to partake in a multi-latency sleep test (MLST), where my mean sleep latency was 3 minutes and mean REM latency was 1 minute (!!) across four allotted nap periods. It is considered standard to achieve REM sleep 70-90 minutes after falling asleep.

I am content with my routine now that I am diagnosed, so I am not seeking ‘advice’. But I was rather interested if anyone knew of (or could direct me) how such ‘out-of-self’ experiences would correlate with REM sleep.

Either way, as a result of this I am now a strong advocate for napping as a means for consolidating memory (although I suspect this is much more easier and also beneficial for me, and perhaps not for the entire population). Maybe this explains how I was able to do so well academically even when limited for years to my zombie “auto-pilot” level of functioning whilst awake. Also I recently learnt that Winston Churchill was a keen napper, so hey, that helps.

I feel like REM is a ‘missing piece’ that ought to compliment areas of neurology that would otherwise be profoundly beneficial findings. But this is most likely just due to my lack of knowledge towards most things science-related.

Tim, could you start asking about evening rituals as well (or even daily rituals…not necessarily done during the evening or morning)? I read the book “The Way of the Seal” and he mentions doing evening rituals and they seem very powerful as well. Thanks for the awesome podcast! I look forward to each episode

Tim, my man, you keep bringing it back around to the psychedelics. We’re really intrigued by the research about these things, but please hang up the phone when you get whatever message you’re looking for; the world needs more early-stage John C Lillys and not late-stage ones.

Regarding float tanks: Some of the research on these for pain management and psychiatric benefits is impressive. I’ve personally had a HUGE short-term (1 week post float) anxiety reduction from the floats that I’ve taken. The first one in particular, for several days after, I was cognitively “outside” my anxious thoughts (like, the feeling would arise and I would go “oh, that’s anxiety” and then ignore it). Possibly something to do with the brain powering down the constant threat-scanning during the float, due to lack of an environment.

I’m unsure of long-term benefit, but they were one of the big helpers for me (along with training working memory, exercise and social time) in recovering from the long-term effects of a medication-triggered psych emergency (which were basically identical to the cognitive damage from traumatic brain injury following an unintended psychedelic trip).

Notes for anyone interested in the float stuff:

1: Use a big tank if you can. Bumping against the walls is off-putting, and if you have a tight back/neck it can help to float with your arms over your head in a “hands up” gesture, or behind your head. I believe that the Float Center in Oakland has the biggest tanks in the Bay Area, not sure about other areas.

2: Your mileage may vary on this, but go right before a sleep or nap, and go when you are not under the effects of stimulants (calculate your caffeine dosage that day, no cigarettes for a couple hours beforehand, etc.). You will sleep like a GOD afterward and the positive effects seem to last longer. Every time I went in the morning, I ended up dragging tail all day instead. This may only apply to the chronically sleep deprived.

3: Earplugs. Good quality earplugs. Cannot stress this enough, not just because it is distracting but because of swimmer’s ear.

Tim, RE Question of the Day: Have you checked out the Alexander Technique at all? It’s not the same as other similar-looking stuff; the basic concept is about learning to consciously override habitual patterns of movement and activity, which probably has some benefits beyond posture or pain management. Aldous Huxley was a huge fan. One caveat I’ve heard is that a lot of new-school teachers bring in new-age woo or baggage from other modalities. Still though, might be worth a look.

Tim! Please, please please interview Natalia Avseenko.

On Mon, Sep 14, 2015 at 9:38 PM, The Blog of Author Tim Ferriss wrote:

> Tim Ferriss posted: ” DISCLAIMER: DO NOT USE ANY DRUGS OR SUBSTANCES > WITHOUT CONSULTING A MEDICAL PROFESSIONAL. THIS IS FOR INFORMATIONAL > PURPOSES ONLY. “Be curious.” – Dr. Dan Engle Martin > Polanco (@Martin_Polanco7), M.D., is the founder and program director of > Crossroads”

I bought the electronic version of 4 hour work week on nook and would like a blank dreamline please. CAn’t find it on the website. thanks.

I’ve been wanting to suggest this for a while now, but every recent episode it seems to me Peter Levine (researcher and psychotherapist, developer of Somatic Experiencing) would be the perfect guest for a future episode! He is such a pioneer in the area of PTSD/Trauma, but in general a ‘master psychologist’ with so much wisdom and expertise to share on areas such as nervous system regulation, transcendental experiences and a general understanding of us humans!

Tim I was wondering if you could talk more about your ayahuasca experiences. Where did you do it, how did you choose where you did it and with what shaman and what were your experiences and how did it benefit you.

Another great guest to have on on this topic would be Chris Kilham, his latest book is Ayahuasca Test Pilots. You can find him at http://medicinehunter.com/

Very exciting cast. Tim I find it a bit curious that you seem a little apologetic or embarrassed about the fact that your experiences were profound and mystical and may have altered your atheistic world view or at the very least gave you some food for thought in that direction. I believe it was Sam Harris who said he would love to debate somebody who had the ability to make him rethink his position on something. If plant medicines did that for you, embrace it, respect it, and if possible share it. Clearly some psychedelic experiences are deeply personal and some are so profound you couldn’t find the words to share it if you wanted to. But if in your mental travels, you met a god, goddess, angel, demon or whoever, and they said something you found worthwhile, I for one would love to hear about it and I’m sure I’m not alone.

I will extend the hand of sharing by offering a personal experience. I would like to propose that while group experiences have their place, what was not explored in the cast was how deeply two people can go together if they are lovers or close friends. In 1984 I took a very healthy dose of shrooms with a beautiful woman I was deeply in love with. The setting was nothing special, an average Hollywood apartment. It might be significant that she was a Krishna devotee and had an altar and art work dedicated to the Indian pantheon. When the visions began we ended up embracing without any sexual intent and talking about what we saw. Not unexpectedly, I saw her as Radha, the woman often depicted with Krishna in Indian religious art, It was photo real, I could see each jewel and each strand of thread in her garments. There was the sensation of “going down a level” as if we were on an elevator heading underground. The next level took us to a Greco Roman environment where I saw her as a more stately Athena- like goddess figure. We had stopped talking by this point and were so overwhelmed with love for each other that tears were streaming down our faces and there wasn’t the slightest question that we were exactly on the same wavelength. The descending of levels continued with each one more emotional profound and visually vivid. The last one was a Babylonian environment where I saw her as Ishtar. Draped in emeralds and green silk. She emanated feminine energy at an almost blinding intensity. When it wound down we were still embraced as tightly as possible, both of having the sense of a complete merging into one consciousness.

Tim don’t be afraid to accept what you are offered by the plants and please share whatever you can. You are liked and respected by millions. If you saw an angel or goddess, and some idiot thinks you are weird because of it, fuck ’em.

Hey tim! Loving the willingness to go into psychedelics and the awesome terrain therein. I interviewed one of Dan’s colleagues on MDMA assisted psychotherapy on my podcast. You might enjoy it as well as my interviews and posts on ayahuasca.

Dr Vanderveer might be a good interview down the road if you want to discuss MDMA.

Rock on!

Tim do you have any experience with the neurofeedback training from biocybernaut? It’s the one popularized by Dave Asprey as “40 years of Zen.”

Dear Tim,

You will like it. This fits into the body experiments that you do.

Please explore the “alternative medicine” that treats the relation between DENTAL OCCLUSION, BALANCE and symmetry of the body, posture and spine and neurological movement disorders (Dystonia, postural collapse, Tourette’s, Parkinson’s).

(The quotes in “alternative” come from the fact that it is actually a more scientific approach than dental “pseudo-science” which is largely based on esthetics)

I was a 42 year old athlete running 10k and swimming 1K several times a week until a negligent dental treatment caused my body to collapse, my skull to “sink” and my spine to get twisted. Within 24 hours I was “Stephen Hawking” like twisted and dystonic, with severe neurological symptoms.

In my blog I describe the experimental treatment with “do it your own” home made dental splints that allowed me to recover health.

I did extensive research and found out that mainstream dentistry is based on opinions, many dangeorus myths and fallacies. It ignores the scietific evidence while there are hundreds of thousands of sufferers and hindreds of top notch dentists who try to fix damage done by other dentist.

Please start with this post in my blog (“can you trust your dentist?” It.went viral) and browsethorugh the blog.

http://wp.me/p5BXae-6t

I realky think that this is a subject that can really interst you and your readers. You may even want to try to build your own splint producing orthopedic forces (with a bio mechanic lever effect centered on molar teeth) that stretch and allign your spine. For a few days. It will blow you away. I promise.

What a great episode, Tim!

I’ve tried recently the floating tank for the first time and, oh boy, that was an experience! I was inspired by the book “You must be joking, Mr Feynmen”, by the way. Despite of the fact that I’ve been meditating regularly for years, the hour in the floating tank revealed a lot of things for me. I couldn’t just shut my thoughts down. When you are left alone only with your head and no other senses, it’s quite shocking first. I can’t say that was a very pleasant experience… I was able to come down and achieve total silence in my head after around 30-40 minutes only.

Your discussion inspired me though to try it consistently for a couple of weeks. I totally see how it could be really beneficial.

I would definitely like to learn more about lucid dreaming. Would you share your experience and how in particular can you use lucid dreaming for self exploration?

Anyone catch what the name of the Buddhist book on 5MeO DMT was?

Thanks,

Mickey

Thanks very much Tim Ferriss! Love all the podcasts, this one was amazing and well done for speaking about these types of topics. Just wanted to add a book recomendation for psychadelics – “Food of the Gods: The Search for the Original Tree of Knowledge A Radical History of Plants, Drugs, and Human Evolution” by Terence McKenna

Fascinating, period. Great stuff, and certainly not “woo-woo” as you feared. I’d love more on this topic.

Hi Tim,

Have you heard of the research done on Matthieu Ricard as presented in the book Destructive Emotions? Ricard was able to suppress the startle reflex while under three different meditative states. At the time of that publication he was described as Oser, a German national, instead of the Frenchman that he is. He was “revealed” in The Wisdom of Compassion by Victor Chan. I’m asking to get your view on meditation. Is it at best a transformative tool, or an elaborate form of denial at worst, or even a sophisticated coping mechanism? In the life story of the Buddha, after his enlightenment, he was reported to be able to see all his past lives, but they no longer affected him or caused him to produce more negative karma – actions. By this example the past is not, and cannot, be wiped away, the “healing” is in the transformation of ones view, and therefore response to, the past which is the “liberation”. In Buddhist practice, as far as I understand it, the past is brought up, not to be gotten rid of, but examined, and the ineffective conditioned response is de-conditioned. So the seed, or karma, does not produce the same fruit. In some traditions, like the one Larry Brilliant M.D., former Executive Director of Google.org and founder of the Seva Foundation, is from, teaches the natural giving up of ineffective patterns through an evolving preference of the effective response rather than the rejection of the ineffective response or behavior. It is the notion that the flower doesn’t fight the winter cold, but blossoms with the warmth of the spring. Doctor Brilliant is a peer of Doctor Richard Alpert aka Ram Dass, the original researcher of psychedelics. If possible, could you share what you’ve so far concluded?

I think that it is important to point out that Martin Polanco is not a degreed medical doctor and therefore it is not accurate or appropriate to put the letters “MD” after his name. This is particularly important since conventional wisdom about best practices is that a medical professional (MD, nurse, or EMT, typically) is present during ibogaine treatments for drug addiction, and that an MD should be on call during the treatments in case the patient’s life becomes endangered. I am pretty sure that Martin Polanco does typically have trained medical staff on hand during treatments, and that there is typically an MD on call for emergencies. However, he does not have a medical degree.

I did Ibogaine 3 times. I like the stuff. It is a very strange trip. And the days after it are imo simply described as: No thinking, smiling happy. Absolute peace in the brain. Nerve believed that something can do that.

But for the addiction i have to say, ibogaine just takes the craving and deletes trauma. After ibogain people with addiction have to change there lives, not going back into old behavior. You need professional help after it. I got my kratom addiction ended only with help after it.

Probably Tim’s most revealing podcast. So thankful that you shared with us your journey as a truth seeker. I knew there was more to you and your work than what you have broadcast this far.

Please do an interview with Graham Hancock, that would be just WOW.

Does anyone know of equally powerful alternatives to float tanks? They are awesome, but it’s not environmentally sustainable for 7 billion people to use 800-1200 pounds of salt for a personal float tank. I’m curious whether there’s an good substitute requiring a significantly smaller environmental footprint. Thanks!

Experimenting on yourself may have adverse side effects lol

Pop down the amazon and film it all man, far out, man.

Tim, Will you or have you ever talked at length about your experiences using these drugs as therapy? Or even what was the catalyst that drove the need or desire to want to do this type of introspection?

really col stuff

Tim (or his evil algorithmic twin) posted a link to this podcast on Facebook, which I’d listened to previously and found fascinating. I suppose my lab friends, though descended from the Siberian tribes described in the link below, (and thus they have an odd predisposition towards traipsing through the woods to find unusual mushrooms like morels) would have some issues with the deeper properties of mushrooms such as Tim and his guests describe here, but I wonder if that is due their bias at working at huge multi-national corporations and thus biased, and skeptical of anything not created in the lab (Like the “Jimmys” in the comments below, unconvinced unless it is explained to them on their level & cultural norms). So it’s wonderful to see these powerful and beneficial mushrooms getting their due research and, uh, experimentation, and finally bringing these to the western world.

Now, in light of the holiday season, I ran across the link below, about some of the interesting symbols of Christmas, such as those funny looking mushrooms, which turn out to be Fly agaric. And what is the deal with those flying reindeer? Well, read the link to find out. Happy holidays!

BBC link

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MkCS9ePWuLU

Mushrooms from the Shamanic Traditions

http://www.dosenation.com/listing.php?id=5514

Awesome interview. Any study showing good results on enhancing the brain’s functions after a light stroke ? Would love to hear about it. Thanks!